Rudeness at Wilco Shows

[Dude]

Is it me or has the overall rudeness at Wilco and solo Tweedy shows has died down quite a bit over the years? By rudeness, I mean a pretty wide gamut of inconsiderate behavior which includes talkers during songs, request-shouters during songs, people who go "WOOOOOOOHOOOOOOOO!" the entire time even during the quieter songs, the shushers who are just as annoying as the whoopers, the cell-phone talkers, the 6'5 tall guys who decide they need to be front and center, people who are overly impressed with their iPhones / Crackberries, the inebriated jerks, etc.

 

The whooper / shusher battle seems to disrupt the Sunken Treasure DVD quite a bit, and maybe that still happens at shows, but it seems like people are a bit more respectful. I'm not saying it's perfect, either, but it seems that people are more civil for the most part. Is it my imagination? Are people generally less rude, the same, or more at Wilco shows these days in your opinion?

[drunkonaquariums]

I voted "about the same" because I've only seen 4 Wilco shows, all since 2007. The first time I saw Wilco was in an auditorium with seats. To my dismay, through the first several songs of the show everyone in the back half of the floor was sitting down. I can't sit down for a rock show, much less a Wilco show. I need to stand, move and feel the music. After about 5 songs I couldn't take it so I stood up and some around me did the same. I could hear comments and tell that many people were irritated that we were standing. To me, it was ridiculous. I don't come to the show and get shitty drunk and scream the whole time, because it's not really enjoyable that way either. But I like to have a good time at a show. Wilco's "Daddy Rock" reputation is somewhat deserved when you have shushers and sitters at the show. I think you can still analyze all you want, but stand the fuck up!

[SGL]

Im not sure. I saw Jeff solo in Champaign this winter and it was a very respectful crowd and noone was really rude at all.

BUT I saw the full band in OKC this summer and the people in the audience were horrible.. people were throwing sharpie markers onstage and others were screaming stuff trying to be funny, when really all they accomplished was looking like a tool in front of about 2000 people. It was shocking to see how rude they were to the band and everyone else around them.

[bleedorange]

the 6'5 tall guys who decide they need to be front and center

 

I'm not sure how or why this would be considered rude. Tall people don't have a right to stand up close at a concert?

 

(For the record, I'm 6'0")

[cryptique]

Yeah, I never understood that complaint either.

[Dude]

I'm not sure how or why this would be considered rude. Tall people don't have a right to stand up close at a concert?

 

(For the record, I'm 6'0")

 

Because they can get just as clear of a view of the stage five or ten rows back. If I were that tall, I'd be a bit more respectful of the people behind me. Most don't seem to give a shit, though.

[Shakespeare In The Alley]

Because they can get just as clear of a view of the stage five or ten rows back. If I were that tall, I'd be a bit more respectful of the people behind me. Most don't seem to give a shit, though.

No offense, but that's bullshit.

 

If a tall person got there early, waited in line, why should he/she not be allowed to have that front row spot?

 

I think shorter people should think about this, and get to the show earlier to get up there for themselves, instead of having to ask/bitch about a tall person being there.

[bleedorange]

No offense, but that's bullshit.

[Guest Speed Racer]

I think you're allowed to do a lot of that at shows (especially showing up to a show as tall as you were when you woke up that morning). The issue of rudeness, to me, comes only when someone asks you to stop and you refuse (excepting, of course, blatant harassment). Whoopers only bother me during quiet songs (I think a certain amount of yelling is required at a rock show, no?). Phone folks I don't give a rip about, unless they're conversation is loud, and then they're just a 'talker' to me. Again, only bothers me during quiet songs.

 

Inebriated jerks made up a good portion of crowds through 2001, judging by the boots I have. Hell, on more than one occasion, the inebriated jerks were the ones on stage. But, there's definitely strength in numbers, and Wilco's fans have for the most part aged out of that. At every show I've been to, Jeff has called someone out from the stage, and they've generally complied.

 

To sum, I don't think there has been a change in rudeness so much as there have been growing pains among fans, relating to both how they perceive the band (2006 Wilco was NOT 1997 Wilco) and how they approach the venue (stand-up, sit-down, fight fight fight!).

 

The ONLY annoying attendees to me are the shushers. Honestly, the dude you're yelling at has consumed about 10 beers too many, and you think a "shhhhh!" is going to quiet him down? Two loud noises don't make a quiet.

[Shakespeare In The Alley]

I think you're allowed to do a lot of that at shows (especially showing up to a show as tall as you were when you woke up that morning). The issue of rudeness, to me, comes only when someone asks you to stop and you refuse (excepting, of course, blatant harassment). Whoopers only bother me during quiet songs (I think a certain amount of yelling is required at a rock show, no?). Phone folks I don't give a rip about, unless they're conversation is loud, and then they're just a 'talker' to me. Again, only bothers me during quiet songs.

 

Inebriated jerks made up a good portion of crowds through 2001, judging by the boots I have. Hell, on more than one occasion, the inebriated jerks were the ones on stage. But, there's definitely strength in numbers, and Wilco's fans have for the most part aged out of that. At every show I've been to, Jeff has called someone out from the stage, and they've generally complied.

 

To sum, I don't think there has been a change in rudeness so much as there have been growing pains among fans, relating to both how they perceive the band (2006 Wilco was NOT 1997 Wilco) and how they approach the venue (stand-up, sit-down, fight fight fight!).

 

The ONLY annoying attendees to me are the shushers. Honestly, the dude you're yelling at has consumed about 10 beers too many, and you think a "shhhhh!" is going to quiet him down? Two loud noises don't make a quiet.

Agreed.

 

Everyone at these shows paid money to enjoy a show. Not everyone enjoys shows the same way. Unless it REALLY bothers me, then I could care less what other people are doing. If I'm bothering someone, and they ask me to stop, I'll stop. I'd hope for the same courtesy from others.

 

People that have a sense of entitlement that every concertgoer must follow this common set of rules are just foolish to me.

[bleedorange]

The ONLY annoying attendees to me are the shushers. Honestly, the dude you're yelling at has consumed about 10 beers too many, and you think a "shhhhh!" is going to quiet him down? Two loud noises don't make a quiet.

 

Definitely agree with that. They exacerbate the problem and do nothing to alleviate it. Although, they only seem to be problems at solo shows.

 

The only real moments of rudeness I've encountered was recently in OKC where someone was throwing sharpies and another was shining a laser pointer. But those were more directed at the band than other attendees, which I thought made the problem even weirder.

 

Talkers don't even bother me anymore. It's a rock show and it's plenty loud enough to drown that out.

[MattZ]

Our brains are just not equipped to receive those kind of sound waves without sustaining damage.

[Dude]

No offense, but that's bullshit.

 

If a tall person got there early, waited in line, why should he/she not be allowed to have that front row spot?

 

I think shorter people should think about this, and get to the show earlier to get up there for themselves, instead of having to ask/bitch about a tall person being there.

 

The shorter people are waiting just as long as the tall people, though, and it's often just a matter of how people rush in after the gate that determines who is directly in front of you. Lots of people cut ahead in the GA area regardless of how early they got there. I don't think I've ever seen a tall guy who didn't cut or push ahead of other people in order to stake out his spot, and this usually pisses people off more than the simple fact that he's tall to begin with.

[watch me fall]

It's a rock show and it's plenty loud enough to drown that out.

 

You would think that wouldn't you? Sadly, it's not always the case.

[Shakespeare In The Alley]

The shorter people are waiting just as long as the tall people, though, and it's often just a matter of how people rush in after the gate that determines who is directly in front of you. Lots of people cut ahead in the GA area regardless of how early they got there. I don't think I've ever seen a tall guy who didn't cut or push ahead of other people in order to stake out his spot, and this usually pisses people off more than the simple fact that he's tall to begin with.

Well, tall people are not the only ones who cut through crowds. Anyone doing that is obnoxious, so that's not really the point.

 

But saying that tall people should give up front row spots is just ludicrous. If they got there early, and legitimately got that spot, then by all means, it's theirs. Shorter people can work around them.

[bleedorange]

You would think that wouldn't you? Sadly, it's not always the case.

 

You're right. I've just been fortunate enough to not have had to deal with it in my immediate vicinity at Wilco shows, so whatever talking has existed is never loud enough to bother me.

[Guest Speed Racer]

the 6'5 tall guys who decide they need to be front and center

 

Of course, you could also invert this to read: short people who show up at concerts vocally astonished and annoyed that they are still short.

 

And, um, to clarify: do short people (and medium-heighted people) not also push to the front to stake out their space? I thought that was sort of how people got to the front, never having tried myself.

 

People who have a clear view of the stage 5 or 10 rows back are also 5 or 10 rows away from Wilco, and frankly some people don't want to be.

 

Really short folks have it rough, but so do really tall folks: it's a lot easier to appear rude when it's a lot easier to appear.

[drunkonaquariums]

I go to Wilco shows with my buddy who's 6'6". Our philosophy is that virtually anywhere he stands he's going to be blocking someone's view. Just because he's tall, he shouldn't have to spend the show walking on eggshells making sure he's not blocking anyone. And we're big Wilco fans, we don't want to stand way in back where the sound bounces around in a lot of venues. I'm not very tall and it sucks when somebody blocks me, but it's a part of the deal with general admission floors.

 

I forgot to mention in my earlier post that what I can't stand are the vehement song-requesters. Not just at Wilco shows but shows in general. Give it up. They are playing a set list. Your song's either on there or not. At least Wilco takes requests through their web site. From recordings I've heard this seems to happen a ton at Tweedy solo shows. People just screaming song titles.

[Shakespeare In The Alley]

"Do you find something comical about my appearance while I am driving my automobile?

[Guest Speed Racer]

From recordings I've heard this seems to happen a ton at Tweedy solo shows. People just screaming song titles.

 

If some guy hadn't shouted "Too Far Apart" at the 11/05/2005 Madison show, a full theater of people and I would have missed out on 2:05 of pure awesome. Chronic shouters are bad, but if you pick one title to shout and only do it once, I can't fault you for it.

[Dude]

Of course, you could also invert this to read: short people who show up at concerts vocally astonished and annoyed that they are still short.

 

And, um, to clarify: do short people (and medium-heighted people) not also push to the front to stake out their space? I thought that was sort of how people got to the front, never having tried myself.

 

 

The short people aren't blocking the five or six people behind them, though. There's these things that are called light rays, and they, lo and behold, are actually blocked by physical bodies as they bounce off the various band members of the stage on their safe and hopefully unobstructed journey to the audience members below. Believe it or not, 6'5" guy actually prevents several people behind him from receiving those light rays. I know this is a bit difficult to grasp...

[Shakespeare In The Alley]

The short people aren't blocking the five or six people behind them, though. There's these things that are called light rays, and they, lo and behold, are actually blocked by physical bodies as they bounce off the various band members of the stage on their safe and hopefully unobstructed journey to the audience members below. Believe it or not, 6'5" guy actually prevents several people behind him from receiving those light rays. I know this is a bit difficult to grasp...

Obviously tall people block aspects of the show, but I just don't see how you can say they shouldn't be allowed in the front. Height is certainly not controllable. If a freakishly tall person loves Wilco, and gets to a show good and early, then sucks for the people who end up behind him. But I think it's ridiculous to expect taller folks to sacrifice the chance at a front row spot.

[Guest Speed Racer]

Believe it or not, 6'5" guy actually prevents several people behind him from receiving those light rays. I know this is a bit difficult to grasp...

 

I get that. But he loves Wilco just as much as you - maybe MORE, and nothing but a freak accident will change the fact that he can't fit in the backseat of a car or a commercial airliner ever again.

 

If you ask him if you can be in front of him and he denies you, he's not a rude tall person, he's just a rude person.

[drunkonaquariums]

If some guy hadn't shouted "Too Far Apart" at the 11/05/2005 Madison show, a full theater of people and I would have missed out on 2:05 of pure awesome. Chronic shouters are bad, but if you pick one title to shout and only do it once, I can't fault you for it.

 

Well, that's cool. It's also different when you're yelling out a title of an old or rare song. Maybe one he doesn't typically play live. But for the most part I hear people yelling "SUNKEN TREASURE!" or "HEAVY METAL DRUMMER!"

[Shakespeare In The Alley]

I get that. But he loves Wilco just as much as you - maybe MORE, and nothing but a freak accident will change the fact that he can't fit in the backseat of a car or a commercial airliner ever again.

 

If you ask him if you can be in front of him and he denies you, he's not a rude tall person, he's just a rude person.

I have mixed feelings about this. I think, if asked, the tall person should let a short person in front, but it puts the tall person in an incredibly awkward situation. If he says yes, his front row spot is gone. if he says no, he's an ass, and he will be discussed and bashed mercilessly on boards like this.